Weblog entry #110 for ajt

Do I want a Nokia N800?
Posted by ajt on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 14:02
Tags: none.
It's my birthday at the end of the month. My mother-in-law-equivalent has given me some money and combined with this month's pay rise I've got cash burning a hole in my pocket.

I could:

* Get a Nokia N800
* Get a Canon EOS 400D or even a 40D
* Get a new home server/cascade my desktop to server

I already have a nice Canon EOS Elan (50E) 35mm camera and selection of lenses, so it would be nice to have a digital camera body as well. I've been putting of buying a digital SLR because the prices keep falling and the features keep improving - too much deflation for me to splash out £600...

I really need to replace my home server built from scarp from work. I could either get a new desktop/laptop system and use my current desktop system as the server, or get a new deskside server straight off. If I did get a new desktop system then I'd give my dad my current TFT screen and get a new one.

Finally there is the Nokia N800. It's £250, just £70 less than a cheap Dell laptop. It's ever so cute, it runs Debian but what would I do with it?

Alternatively I could buy some cheap shares of a UK bank and wait for the price to rise once the silly season stops...

 

Comments on this Entry

Posted by Grimnar (85.221.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 16:19
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Skip the phone. It´s only fun the first night anyways. Build yourself a nice new server or go outside and take some nice pictures.

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Posted by ajt (204.193.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 16:53
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The Nokia isn't a phone, it's a "Internet Tablet", however you have a point, it's only a short term toy.

Getting a new camera would get me out and about a bit more, as I can't use the excuse of cost and delay with slide film any more.

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by endecotp (86.6.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 16:42
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Buy the camera. I bought a 400D late last year, having waited because of the "deflation" effect; it has lasted for a year without being superceded by a newer model (though the price has fallen). I'm very pleased with it.

But since this is "debian administration", I should point out that
- The Canon digital SLRs run DOS!!! Yes really!!!
- They don't mount as storage devices over USB; they do work with the gphoto program, though it is rather slow for me. I use a CF-to-USB adapter instead.

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Posted by ajt (84.12.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 19:59
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I like the idea of a camera, it gets me out of the house and away from my computer! The 400D looks better than the 350D but I'd really like the next level up 30D/40D - however I don't know if I can justify the extra cash.

Running DOS isn't so bad, South West Trains brand new Siemens Desiro trains run either Windows 3.1 or Windows NT 3.x - can't tell which I've not been close enough when they reboot the train...

Connection to Debian being a pain is not good, I run Debian for my desktop, server and laptop systems, we're a Windows free household.

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by endecotp (86.6.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 20:09
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> South West Trains brand new Siemens Desiro trains run
> either Windows 3.1 or Windows NT 3.x

A friend of mine was stuck for a while on a broken-down Virgin Cross Country train somewhere in the back of beyond; eventually a bloke turned up, opened a panel and rebooted it. Off they went.

As for the camera, the 40 is quite a bit heavier, if that matters to you. I would probably spend the extra on a nice lens rather than upgrading the body.

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Posted by ajt (84.12.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 20:21
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I've been at Woking once stuck on a train which they "rebooted" twice before they gave up and told us to get on another one...

I like heavier cameras they are easier to work with, my EOS 50E is much better with the 4xAA battery pack on than without it. I've already got some nice prime EF lenses so I'm not planning on getting any more in the near future!

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by eric (82.254.xx.xx) on Tue 18 Sep 2007 at 22:11
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I like the idea of a camera, it gets me out of the house and away from my computer!

that was what i was going to tell you :) I own a 400D myself and is a great 'amateur' DSLR. And if you own some lenses better, don't forget that the lens itself is more important than the camera [1]. (In fact, it's not totally right because some things [2] can't be possible with or without a very good lens... but to start with DSLR i think it's a good option).
30D/40D may be good, but i think the real difference is between 400D and its APSC captor and full frame cameras like 5D... the difference is to have a big angle or very big angle. (with APSC, you have a 1,6x factor on your lens, your images are cropped)

The fact that it's not UMS (i just try and in fact it's not) doesn't really matter, a cheap 30euros usb card reader is sufficient to avoid the problem

sorry for the very bad english photography vocabulary, but i don't know it... in French it's sufficiently difficult :)

[1] moreover if they are good lenses
[2] number of AF points, ISO and quality of ISO, number of images in 'rafal' mode, etc.

:eric:
http://blog.sietch-tabr.com

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Posted by ajt (84.12.xx.xx) on Wed 19 Sep 2007 at 21:41
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My EOS Elan (50E) is a great amateur film SLR, one-up from the consumer grade 1000/500/Rebel models. For my lenses I avoided the consumer grade lenses and have all amateur-grade USM models mostly fixed focal length primes but non of the silly money 'L' series stuff.

I don't like the focal length shift you get with the smaller imaging size of digital relative to 35mm film - but at least it will allow me to use my 20mm lens in the UK - it's great in the Californian deserts but not much use in rural Hampshire.

Digital is more expensive that film, the EOS 400D is a lot more than the EOS 30 which is probably a higher grade of camera, but you save in the film processing stakes. I suppose at over £12 a throw for a roll of film and processing, digital can pay for it's self if you take a few pictures.

If I get a camera it's a good job I upgraded my desktop system with more RAM, some of those image files can get really big!

Where in France are you? My better half is French so we are there often. In fact I've blogged about better Linux coverage in France than the UK before, if I only I spoke French our problems would be solved!

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by eric (82.255.xx.xx) on Wed 19 Sep 2007 at 22:27
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For my lenses I avoided the consumer grade lenses and have all amateur-grade USM models mostly fixed focal length primes but non of the silly money 'L' series stuff.

yes, USM lenses are good. I just own a 50mm f/1.4 myself but it's a great one, the quality is better and it's faster than my poor 28-80mm f/3.5-5.6 than i kept from an EOS 3000N.
The L are in fact... too expensive :-(

I don't like the focal length shift you get with the smaller imaging size of digital relative to 35mm film - but at least it will allow me to use my 20mm lens in the UK - it's great in the Californian deserts but not much use in rural Hampshire.

Yes, it depends of you photo usage. I found that my 28mm on the APSC, so I got a 42mm-equivalent (not really, but it's too complicated to explain and it's not the point here), is too much to a lot of my use cases: landscapes and urban architectures.

If I get a camera it's a good job I upgraded my desktop system with more RAM, some of those image files can get really big!

In fact, the RAW files that my 400D generate are 9-10 Mb big. I use RAW files now, but under Linux it's not a simple problem, rawstudio and ufraw are good programs but they are still far behind proprios ones (which i don't use and don't really know). The purchase of a new PC was a big breath of air to my digital processing, digikam was really suffering before that :)

Where in France are you? My better half is French so we are there often. In fact I've blogged about better Linux coverage in France than the UK before, if I only I spoke French our problems would be solved!

In live in the south of France, near Marseille and Aix-en-Provence. If you pass nearly, feel free to send me an e-mail.
... and I wish i better speak English... (google don't help me much :(

:eric:
http://blog.sietch-tabr.com

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Posted by ajt (204.193.xx.xx) on Thu 20 Sep 2007 at 13:09
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I've got a nice 20mm USM, 28mm USM and the cheap 50mm f1.8. I really like the 20mm, but it's too wide for England with 35mm film. The apparent focal length shift on these lenses would make them more useful here. I've also got the old and nice 28-105mm USM and the very old but still nice 70-210mm USM.

I like landscape, trees in particular, so I should be able to get by with my current lens mix. With digital I'm essentially shifting them all up a category, 20mm -> 35mm, 28mm -> 50mm and so on.

I see there is gimp-ufraw, which uses dcraw to read the RAW files. My box is reasonable, an AMD64 with 2Gb of RAM and plenty of spare disk space. So I should be able to work with the RAW files from a EOS 400D without a problem.

My better half is half Breton half from Aisne. We try to go to Brittany often as it's pretty and easy to get to from the south of England.

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by eric (82.255.xx.xx) on Thu 20 Sep 2007 at 19:02
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In fact, Brittany (= Bretagne) is really good. I lived near and studied there and really like it, people is very sympathic, but... the weather is so bad... (but can I say that to english people? ;-)

:eric:
http://blog.sietch-tabr.com

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Posted by ajt (84.12.xx.xx) on Thu 20 Sep 2007 at 20:13
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We like it a lot. Place names are so "British" - well Welsh mostly. The food is good, I really like the sea-food and the cider. It's also an awful lot cheaper than Hampshire, houses in particular are so cheap... Everyone has been really friendly and we have never had any problems there.

Weather wise I'm from the north-west of England and except for a few years in California, I'm use to cool and wet weather, so too me Hampshire is mild and Brittany is almost tropical! We've camped three times now and it's always been very good in July-September!

One year a small rural supermarket had a Linux magazine with the cover story of installing Debian on old SPARC kit! Here in the UK you are lucky to see a Linux magazine and if you do it's all about dual-booting your XP box with some desktop friendly disto. It's nice to see Linux in the UK, but we are so far behind the rest of Europe on Linux is a bit depressing.

If you ever come to Basingstoke you should say hello...!

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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Posted by undefined (192.91.xx.xx) on Wed 19 Sep 2007 at 18:20
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not to {en,dis}courage your purchase of the N800, but to give you a data point.

i bought the 770, but only because of the plummeting price this summer ($400 -> $150). $150 is about the limit of my "computer toy" price limit, so even if i didn't get a lot of use out of it, it was financially justifiable.

what do i use it for? surfing, ebook reading, music listening, im-ing, server administrating, and email checking. i have an 8 year old thinkpad, but even if i had a smaller, lighter laptop, i would still stick with the 770 for those tasks due to size, weight, and overall convenience. unless i'm typing a lot, i don't mind the onscreen keyboard (and the n800 even supports bluetooth keyboards). it fits somewhere between a pda and a laptop.

my pda is a palm z22 and is used strictly as an organizer (calendar, phone numbers, todo, reminders, etc) as it's not capable of doing much more. my z22 and 770 don't really conflict because the 770 is less specialized, bigger, and heavier than my z22 (which goes everywhere with me). if necessary, the 770 does fit in some pants' pockets and can run gpe.

work (development & productivity)? desktop.
reading (couch, bed, kitchen table)? 770.
errands? pda.
business trip? laptop.
vacation? 770.

to give you a feel, here are the applications i use on my 770:
- browser (w/ opera or gecko engine)
- pidgin
- media streamer (until i can find/choose a foss upnp audio player)
- xterm
- openssh
- otpcalc
- fbreader
- mplayer
- claws (mail)

a friend was considering purchasing a 770 for use as a 802.11 sip phone (~$100), so i tested it against his asterix server, and it worked okay (though looks odd in public talking to an internet tablet as compared to a phone form-factor).

if you already have a phone that operates as a bluetooth modem with an inexpensive data plan (europe?) and hate carrying around a laptop to fully use the internet, then definitely look into nokia's internet tablets.

i would not have paid more than $150 for what light use (compared to the 8+ hours/day of my desktop or 24-7 of my server) i get out of my 770.

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Posted by ajt (204.193.xx.xx) on Thu 20 Sep 2007 at 13:18
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It seems it's more useful than I thought. I think the full price for the N800 may be too much though as you suggest.

--
"It's Not Magic, It's Work"
Adam

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